F 800 GS - Considerações Finais

[DanielRJ]

Ahhhh .. depois desse tópico tive que descartar duas candidatas que eu tinha pra up. Bagé falou que não presta ... droga.

Vou começar a procurar Varaderos..

[Jota]

bagé, a f800 é boa no off e regular no on.

Boa no off?? Moto sem link e sem ajuste em suspensão?? Tô ´´tiestranhando´´

bagé, realmente falta um ajuste de pré na frente. por isso ela não é ótima nem excelente.
atrás há ajuste de pré e retorno.
além disso, moto leve pra cilindrada, motor muito forte, 6 marchas, alta, curso de suspas muito bom, posição excelente pro off, etc.

sobre eu estar defendendo moto que vou comprar, sem chance, viajei com uma e a achei ruim no asfalto.

[gui dantas]

bagé, a f800 é boa no off e regular no on.

Boa no off?? Moto sem link e sem ajuste em suspensão?? Tô ´´tiestranhando´´

Estaria o senhor interessado em uma e já tá arrumando argumentos para auto-´´sastisfação´´??

.

Bagé, aro 19 é melhor aro 21 no off-road?

[gui dantas]

NA 800GS isso não acontece, a suspa está bem regulada pro meu peso tanto no asfalto como no off-road, não havendo necessidade de regulagem.

Smoker, além da suspa, o motor tá aguentando o peso também, até hoje nenhuma moto minha babou óleo na junta do cabecote!!!! E olha que sou pesadão héin!!!!

Imagina se fosse magrinho que nem você.

[Bagé]

bagé, a f800 é boa no off e regular no on.

Boa no off?? Moto sem link e sem ajuste em suspensão?? Tô ´´tiestranhando´´

Estaria o senhor interessado em uma e já tá arrumando argumentos para auto-´´sastisfação´´??

.

Bagé, aro 19 é melhor aro 21 no off-road?

Poh, perguntinha pega ratão fraca Pra mim tanto faz, só faço off leve mesmo, mas 21 é melhor hehehee...Arruma uma melhor

Faço uma pega ratão pra ti....Que é melhor, suspensão com link ou sem link



.

[Andrei]

Volto a dizer, hoje, única dual de verdade é a TA

off regular pra ruim
on regular pra ruim.

dual mesmo. duplamente ruim.

Pior que tu tens razão Como eu disse, dual é assim mesmo, não faz bem nenhuma das duas, só que a F800 é pior nas duas

No mais, me mostre uma que seja boa nas duas Não vem com super


.

A Cagiva Elefant é assim... por incrível que pareça...

[CARLOS-BSB]

Olha as 2013 aí:

.

[gui dantas]

bagé, a f800 é boa no off e regular no on.

Boa no off?? Moto sem link e sem ajuste em suspensão?? Tô ´´tiestranhando´´

Estaria o senhor interessado em uma e já tá arrumando argumentos para auto-´´sastisfação´´??

.

Bagé, aro 19 é melhor aro 21 no off-road?

Poh, perguntinha pega ratão fraca Pra mim tanto faz, só faço off leve mesmo, mas 21 é melhor hehehee...Arruma uma melhor

Faço uma pega ratão pra ti....Que é melhor, suspensão com link ou sem link

.

Bagé pro seu uso (off leve) nem uma nem outra. O certo seria isso aqui:

BMW and their contribution to the world of motorbike suspension.

Bayerische Motoren Werke: those teutonic Germans and their incessant need to be at the pinnacle of engineering excellence. BMW are responsible for a lot of developments in motorbike suspension - not just the quirky ones. The first hydraulically dampened telescopic fork on a production motorcycle (1937), the longitudinal swinging arm ('50s and '60s), and the long-stroke high-comfort telescopic fork (1970). Because of this, I've given them an entire section to try to explain some of their innovations for which we should all be thankful.
Well perhaps not all, but those riders who have chosen BMW as their steed of choice will know that their bikes have what could best be described as some pretty funky and unconventional suspension systems. BMW, it seems, are never quite happy with the status quo. Why use an existing design when it could be bettered? Why settle for DVD when you can have Blu-Ray? Just because a particular type of suspension system is favoured by the Japanese, and sold on hundreds of thousands of motorbikes every year doesn't necessarily mean that it's the best option. At least not in the eyes of the Germans.
BMW have long been known for their ability to cast scorn the accepted way of things, and pursue other, better methods of achieving the same result. Whether their suspension systems for their bikes actually are better or not I suppose is open to debate. Having ridden and owned a BMW with telelever suspension, I can't understand why its not used on all bikes. Conversely, bullet bike riders will look at a BMW and see nothing but excess weight. You can be certain of one thing with BMW suspension systems: they're different. Very different. So lets start at the back and work forwards.

Rear monolever.


In 1980, BMW introduced the world to the monolever suspension system on the back end of their R80GS big dirt bike. Little did anyone know at the time that it was a sign of the radical design changes to come. Most BMW bikes, modern ones anyway, have shaft drive, so its a given on a beemer that one side of the rear suspension is going to be pretty beefy because it has to house the driveshaft and ultimately the rear drive. BMW capitalised on this and with the monolever, they created a single-sided suspension system, much like the Yamaha monoshock, but the shock / strut unit was mounted to one side of the bike, rather than in the centre. The driveshaft ran down the inside of the single-sided swingarm and into the rear drive. This design helped eliminate the need for beefier engineering at the front of the swingarm which would have been needed to resist the torsional load of having the wheel mounted to a single-sided swingarm.

Rear paralever, first generation.


In 1987, BMW improved on their design and introduced the paralever suspension system on the back end of the new R100GS, a system which found its way on to their K1 sports bike too.
(Note : This is an improvement of a suspension system originally fitted to the Magni Sfida called Parallelogramo. It was also available as a kit for Moto Guzzis in the 80s. Parallelogramo itself is a derivative of a prototype suspension of the same type shown on the MV Agusta 500 in 1950)
Paralever uses the same basic principle as monolever but adds a lower control arm to the mix and an extra pivot point between the main swingarm and the rear drive. The effect is that the old pivoting swingarm now becomes part of a skewing parallelogram system - in fact a geometric double wishbone system just like in a car. This added lateral stiffness to the suspension, but it also kept the rear drive at the same orientation relative to the rest of the bike. Because of the extra link at the rear drive, the strut / shock unit was turned over so that it was "the right way up", and it was still mounted to one side of the bike. Because the whole system now acts as a double swingarm, it substantially reduces the change of load response of the driveshaft. Using this type of suspension was also the impetus for BMW to change to using the engine as an integral stressed member of the frame, which allowed the swingarm and suspension components to be bolted directly to it.

Rear paralever, second generation.


In 1993, the second generation paralever system appeared on the R1100GS. The basic design was the same as the original paralever except that the strut/shock unit was moved away from the side of the bike and on to the centreline, bringing it more in line with the monoshock type system. It also gained a remote preload adjuster and spring plate height adjuster. This new paralever was made of aluminium instead of steel so it was lighter than the original whilst maintaining the strength needed for the single-sided shaft drive system.


Rear paralever, third generation.


Skip forward ten years to 2004 - which tells you how good the paralever II was that its design didn't change in nearly a decade. The third generation paralever appeared in the new R1200GS. This design is similar but at the same time noticably different to its predecessor, and at the time of writing is now the current BMW rear suspension of choice. The control arm was moved above the shaft drive from underneath, and the rear drive was changed to have a hole through the middle of it to save weight. The unsprung weight of the latest generation paralever is considerably lighter than its predecessors. That's not to say that it couldn't still be used as a substantial bludgeoning weapon if you got it off the bike, but in engineering terms, it has slimmed down considerably.

Front telelever.


In 1993, when paralever II appeared on the R1100GS, BMW also introduced their new telelever front end suspension system. The problem with traditional telescopic fork suspension is that all the forces acting on the front of the bike are transmitted to the handlebars, and thus the rider. Some people think this is A Good Thing - it keeps the rider "informed" as to what is going on. Others argue that it is a necessary evil and that telescopic forks are an unfortunate accident of history (see the section on forks above - it's the same reason we got VHS when Betamax was the better system). BMW fell squarely into the second camp, and developed telelever as a method of separating the braking and suspension forces from the steering force. With telelever, there is now a single strut/shock unit in place of the combined spring/shock functions of telescopic forks. Telelever still has front forks, but their primary function now is to make a stiff frame for the front wheel to sit in, and to allow the rider to steer the bike (which is always useful). The strut/shock unit is connected to a wishbone which itself is connected to the frame of the bike at the back via a yoke, and to the crossmember of the forks at the front using a ball joint. When you hit a bump with telelever, the suspension forces are transmitted through the ball joint, across the wishbone and up through the strut / shock unit into the frame of the bike. One of the biggest advantages of this system is that you don't need to engineer an anti-dive system into the forks. The design of the Telelever effectively reduces fork travel under braking to near zero which translates to reduced dive under braking (due to the suspension geometry and the angles of the forces involved in decelleration). Another benefit is that the forces acting on the steering head bearings are dramatically reduced. In fact with telelever, as a rider you have to get used to the concept of braking without the bike diving at the front. It's really quite unique.

Front duolever.


Never being satisfied with resting on their laurels, by 2004 BMW decided that telelever was yesterday's news, and introduced duolever on the front of their first inline-four sports tourer - the K1200S. I'm not sure, but I think some of the BMW engineers might have discovered suspension nirvana with this system as they now finally have double-wishbone type suspension both front and rear. Duolever is an evolution of Norman Hossack's double wishbone / parallelogram suspension, which is why its sometimes referred to as Hossack Suspension (see below). The idea itself has been around since Hossack modified a Honda XL500 in 1979. In the early 90's he modified a BMW K100RS, and whilst it never really caught on in England, German engineers understood the idea instantly. Like the rear paralever, its geometrically a double wishbone system. As with telelever, in duolever the pivoting links and springs are not steered. But with duolever, the physical link from the handlebars to the suspension is radically different, involving a hinged link. If you look at the image here, you'll see the front suspension is completely independent of the steering, with the two only being connected by the hinged link up top. (That link is simply used for turning the fork assembly and provides no structural support or strength). With the combination of paralever III on the rear, and duolever at the front, sitting on and riding a K1200S is unlike riding any other type of motorcycle. Whilst it may technically be the current pinnacle of motorbike suspension design, BMW have created a system which has divided riders into the love/hate camps.

[DanielRJ]

Enquanto uns falam ... outros rodam.

SP - EUA numa F800GS

http://nelsonbad32.blogspot.com.br/

[Bagé]

Enquanto uns falam ... outros rodam.

SP - EUA numa F800GS

http://nelsonbad32.blogspot.com.br/

Isso não quer dizer nada, tem vários que fazem isso de Biz, já teve até um maluco que fez isso numa R1



.

[Smoker]

Enquanto uns falam ... outros rodam.

SP - EUA numa F800GS
http://nelsonbad32.blogspot.com.br/

Isso não quer dizer nada, tem vários que fazem isso de Biz, já teve até um maluco que fez isso numa R1
.

Pois é, o Spidi já rodou para tudo que é canto de Twister, CB500, XX, outros de Fracon, outros de XTE e segue lista grande....


A, mas o cara foi de de "beemedablhiu", então é mais phoda, é mais importante.

Até concordo, se o cara retornou sobre a moto.

[Bagé]

Vou começar a procurar Varaderos..

Se tivesse essa moto nova, eu ia seco numa...Espetacular motocicleta, principalmente quem a usa só para viajar.....Como eu já disse, não vi em nenhuma dessas novas fodásticas uma proteção, freios, conforto como o cavalão, tem defletor até no pé, saí com temperatura negativa, em outras motos eu sentia frio no pé depois de muito tempo, no cavalão tava de boa na lagoa

Depois do cavalão, se eu for pra big trail, só se for ST 1200 ou essa nova galinhona da honda e não sei se vou ter o mesmo que tinha



.

[DanielRJ]

Enquanto uns falam ... outros rodam.

SP - EUA numa F800GS
http://nelsonbad32.blogspot.com.br/

Isso não quer dizer nada, tem vários que fazem isso de Biz, já teve até um maluco que fez isso numa R1
.

Pois é, o Spidi já rodou para tudo que é canto de Twister, CB500, XX, outros de Fracon, outros de XTE e segue lista grande....


A, mas o cara foi de de "beemedablhiu", então é mais phoda, é mais importante.

Até concordo, se o cara retornou sobre a moto.

É que alguém tem que avisá-lo que a moto dele não tem regulagem na suspensão dianteira, então ele não pode viajar nela ..

[gui dantas]

Enquanto uns falam ... outros rodam.

SP - EUA numa F800GS
http://nelsonbad32.blogspot.com.br/

Isso não quer dizer nada, tem vários que fazem isso de Biz, já teve até um maluco que fez isso numa R1
.

Pois é, o Spidi já rodou para tudo que é canto de Twister, CB500, XX, outros de Fracon, outros de XTE e segue lista grande....


A, mas o cara foi de de "beemedablhiu", então é mais phoda, é mais importante.

Até concordo, se o cara retornou sobre a moto.

Mas tem Bandit que não consegue ir nem a Belo Horizonte. Só consegue ir até o Rio Grande do Sul e nada mais!!!!

Se bem que a gora a b12 tá mais pra servir óleo pro pastel da feira do que pra pegar estrada!!!

[Jota]

Se bem que a gora a b12 tá mais pra servir óleo pro pastel da feira do que pra pegar estrada!!!

é que belo horizonte fica longe, mais de 400km, e pra descer todo santo ajuda, né?

[gui dantas]

Se bem que a gora a b12 tá mais pra servir óleo pro pastel da feira do que pra pegar estrada!!!

é que belo horizonte fica longe, mais de 400km, e pra descer todo santo ajuda, né?

[Smoker]

Se bem que a gora a b12 tá mais pra servir óleo pro pastel da feira do que pra pegar estrada!!!

é que belo horizonte fica longe, mais de 400km, e pra descer todo santo ajuda, né?

Putz, mais longe????


Mas é só marca um churrasco aí, Jota.

[Smoker]

Mas tem Bandit que não consegue ir nem a Belo Horizonte. Só consegue ir até o Rio Grande do Sul e nada mais!!!!

Mas que bom que posso ir, né??? Não precisei me privar de outras viagens, como o Churrastiba, por exemplo.

[DanielRJ]

Vixe ..

[Kuati]

... tem defletor até no pé, saí com temperatura negativa, em outras motos eu sentia frio no pé depois de muito tempo, no cavalão tava de boa na lagoa
Depois do cavalão, se eu for pra big trail, só se for ST 1200 ou essa nova galinhona da honda e não sei se vou ter o mesmo que tinha
.

Foi a primeira coisa que reparei a primeira vez que vi uma Varadero, pensei comigo "Essa porra tem proteção contra o vento até no pé! TNC!"
Mas diz aí, devia ser um sufoco e tanto andar com ela em dias quentes, não?
Eu sofria pra caramba na Blackbird no calor, fico imaginando de Varadero.
Varadero deve dar pra andar até com neve, e dependendo da chuva não molha nada!
[ ]'s